That’s Your Favorite?! Media Judgment, Rejection Sensitivity, and Connection
Welcome to GT Radio on the Geek Therapy Network. Here at Geek Therapy, we believe that the best way to understand each other and ourselves is through the media we care about. My name is Josué Cardona, and I'm joined by Link Keller.
Link:Hello. Lara Taylor. Hi.
Josué:And Marc Cuiriz. Hey. Alright. So I've been wanting to talk about this for a while. I think it's something that we we bring up in different ways, and especially when we're talking about, like, key therapy theory and and and mindset and stuff.
Josué:Kind of falls into don't yuck my yum, but it's the language that we use to talk about things. And and I mean by like, the things that we like or don't like. I know I always bring up that example of my favorite Star Wars movie is still The Phantom Menace. Don't tell me how much you hate it. Don't tell me don't tell me that it's horrible.
Josué:It's my it's my favorite. Anyways and so for the sake of to illustrate some of the some of these points, let's briefly talk about and not not not not spoilers or anything about the actual movie, but just Deadpool and Wolverine came out recently. And, Lara, what did you think of Lara of of Wolverine of a Deadpool and Wolverine? I thought
Lara:it was hilarious and an amazing movie. I loved it so much.
Josué:Okay. Mark, what did you think of it?
Marc:I too thought it was quite hilarious. There were many times I was laughing out loud. And a 10 out of 10 movie. Would watch it again.
Josué:Yeah. Link, you haven't seen it. What do you think of the movie?
Link:I think it should have been gayer.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. It was pretty gay.
Link:It was pretty gay. It should have been gayer.
Lara:I think you could make something very gay, and Link would still say,
Link:it should be gay or gay. It could be a little gayer.
Josué:Yeah. For a Disney Marvel movie. Did you know it's Disney's first ever gay movie?
Link:First ever gay character. Wow.
Lara:First ever again. First ever pansexual character.
Josué:Alright. So so I I did not enjoy the movie. I did not like it for a number of reasons, which I won't get into here. But right, like, I I didn't say it's terrible. It's horrible.
Josué:I try to always use language that refers to, like, my feelings, my opinion, and keep it at that. I mean, sometimes I fall into, oh, it's so good. Or I don't usually say it's the best. I don't think I've I've said that. I don't know if I've ever said that.
Josué:But but that's like common language. Right? It's like, oh, it's the best. It's like, it's an amazing movie. 10 out of 10.
Josué:Right? Mark says. And and, like, from from a I understand. You're just saying, I really like it a lot. But the words that you're using are are are are not that.
Josué:Right? If you're someone who, I don't know, takes things very literally, right, you might think like, oh, it's it's the best. It's amazing. And and, like sure. And and I think those aren't that hard to like, I don't I don't really get too affected by by that.
Josué:Like, oh, I didn't like it. Oh, you love it. That's cool. But especially when people talk about a negative negatively about a movie, that's where and depending on how we do it, it's a it gets I think that's where the don't yuck my yum comes in. But it it gets a little I think the language gets a little complicated because I don't think we're saying on like, you you you both already know that I didn't like the movie, but you're not saying that you love the movie, like, in any way.
Josué:Like, it's not related to my feelings about the movie. You're just expressing your own.
Lara:And I think the first time you told us that you didn't like the movie, maybe we were surprised, but it wasn't like, are you crazy? Like
Josué:Yeah.
Lara:How could you not like it? Right?
Josué:But that happens.
Lara:It does happen.
Josué:It happens a lot. When was the last time that happened to any of you where you said you like something and someone reacted in a judgy way.
Marc:Well, I think that happened with me, not necessarily recently, but, like, it's the most, like, iconic thing to me that I can remember is I tried watching The Office Mhmm. And I personally did not like it. I I hated it. I was like, I can't do this. I and everyone kept trying to tell me that, you know, you just had to get through the first couple of seasons.
Marc:It gets better. It gets better. And I'm like, I'm if I have to sit there and get to season three or four for the show to actually get good, I don't I don't wanna keep watching it. Like, I I it was a challenge for me to get through the first season, and that's just the that's just me. But I couldn't I couldn't sit through it, and everybody was, like, giving me a hard time for it.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. I get True.
Lara:There's a couple lines go ahead. I usually give a show, like, two or three episodes, not seasons.
Marc:Yeah. I I really tried. I really tried to get through it. And halfway through the first episode of the second season, I was like, and I'm done. I can't handle the cringe anymore.
Marc:It's it my body was physically reacting to the cringe. I couldn't do it. Couldn't sit through it.
Josué:So I'm curious that backlash. If people are talking about The Office, do you kinda, like, retreat? Do you just walk away? Do you, like
Marc:just I just don't really say any I just don't really say anything. I just like, okay. I think that's fine. But if I, like, make, like, a popular, like, quote from The Office, people are like, well, you didn't even watch it. I'm like, But at this point, it's a huge meme.
Marc:Like, why wouldn't? Why wouldn't I, you know?
Josué:Yeah. Okay. That's a good that's a good example because the office definitely has a cult following. But, like, culty culty. Right?
Josué:Like, Yeah. Like, in the literal sense of cult following. Lara, has that like, when has that happened to you?
Lara:Anytime I say any that I liked any of the Marvel movies in the last well, since The
Josué:phase four?
Lara:Since, yeah, since phase four started, especially
Josué:Marvels.
Lara:The Marvels.
Josué:Yeah. Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah.
Lara:Or or even even Black Widow. Yeah. Mostly mostly the lady led ones.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. I don't get the hate for the Eternals. Like, I really like the Eternals. And people are just like, I don't understand.
Josué:I don't know. But I don't understand why the hatred is so strong. Right? Like so so, like, what what reaction have you received?
Lara:Like, oh, how could you like that woke? Yeah. Mhmm. Mhmm. I received that from certain family members.
Link:Oh, I see. We have very different criticisms of that movie. I understand now. Okay.
Lara:Yeah. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Not the reasons Link wouldn't like the movie.
Lara:Very different. Very different. Yeah. I I think one thing I try to keep in mind with media is that, like, it's subjective. Right?
Lara:Like, you said, like, it it's you're talking about your opinions. And so yeah, that movie might not be what somebody else likes, but don't tell me it's some woke BS when I said I really liked it. Oh. I just wanted more cats. It was great.
Josué:Laura, you you and I have talked about someone that you know that seems to hate on every movie for the last, like, 10
Lara:movie on every movie for the last ten years, except this friend. I can't remember which movie it was now, but actually really liked a movie, and it was one I wasn't that excited about. I can't remember which one it was.
Josué:I forgot too. But I know we talked about this. I was I was also surprised.
Lara:This this friend couldn't understand the storytelling in Captain Marvel, and said it was objectively bad and badly shot. And I are you a filmmaker?
Josué:So yeah. When when people say something is objectively this or that, that really bothers me.
Lara:It's okay if it's your opinion. It's your opinion.
Josué:Yeah. But but see, that's the thing. Right? Like, if I take that literally, I'm like, who who are you? You know?
Josué:When people talk about, like, the pacing was bad, the brain I'm like, who who are you? Who are you? Are you are you you make movies? Are you a director? Are you you you study screenwriting?
Josué:Sometimes they they have, you know, but still, it's still subjective. Still subjective to what? It it it does bother me. And also, again, it goes back to don't yuck my it's like, liked it. It's like, well, you're an idiot.
Josué:Mhmm. Come on.
Lara:Yeah. Yeah. And that and that person that I know would do that for pretty much every movie that I saw that I liked and wasn't attacking me and my opinions except when we're talking about Captain Marvel because I actually engaged them on this conversation. But I learned to just kind of, like, scroll past the post or read it and be like, oh, I can't believe they said that again. Yeah.
Josué:What possessed you to defend Captain Marvel?
Lara:Brie Larson. And and and and Goose.
Marc:Yeah. Understandable with Goose.
Josué:Gotcha. Gotcha. Alright, Link. Has this has this ever happened to you? Yes.
Josué:Anything come up that stands out?
Link:I think I mean, it happens. You know, I can't help myself. I always want to be talking about media. So it's not uncommon for me to come across people who are like, Oh, I didn't like that thing. That I'm like, Oh, I just saw it.
Link:I really liked it. And vice versa. I don't tend to take it too personally. The most exception to that rule was trying to introduce a friend to Steven Universe. And then watching the first couple of episodes and being like, yeah, I really hate this.
Link:This kid's super annoying. And I'm just like, shooing through a wood table like, how dare you?
Josué:You punched
Link:Okay. Us in some Okay. Like, do. Yeah. No.
Link:He's like a little kid, and he is annoying. Like, I get I get where I get where you come. I get I get where you come. And that's sort of where it came from is like very much the like, oh, I I can understand your perspective. I totally do.
Link:But please, dear God, please just listen to what I'm saying and understand me back. And when that doesn't happen, that's where I take like the most emotional psychic damage is the winner just like, no, I was like, at least participate with me in this. You don't have to agree. I'm not trying to convince you, but I just wanna feel like you're understanding where I'm coming from. Yeah.
Link:Yeah. He gets less annoying over time. Okay?
Marc:Listen. Just wait until season three. I promise it gets better.
Josué:Oh, yeah.
Link:Yeah. Try I'm trying to think if there's been an instance where it went the other direction where I was the where I was the stinker. I know I've done that for you, Josue. I think I guess Ready Player One is the one.
Josué:That's exactly what I bring up.
Link:Yeah. Alright. That that was my that was my my villain story.
Josué:I think I I feel like you've done it more
Link:that. I've definitely done it more than that. I try not to, but I definitely have.
Josué:Like like you, my face.
Link:I do think that Ready Player One was that one was the worst one I got you with.
Josué:Okay. Let's let's let's talk about that. Right? So so before that before that, that's foreshadowing. Right?
Josué:Like, that's a little bit to to the conversation. But I have you all heard of this concept of rejection sensitivity dysphoria? Right? Mhmm. When I learned that, I was like, oh, that's me for sure.
Josué:Like, if, like, if I'm giving a presentation, for example, or doing something, and I see someone like their their face changes 1%, I am reading into that like crazy.
Lara:Even even if, like, it's a it's a online one and they got a text or something and it's like, oh, like,
Josué:there is you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There is like, I'm I'm I'm pretty good at telling myself, like, oh, like, they're distracted or something like that.
Josué:It's not about me. But, like, you say something, like, they cock their head or something. Right? Or, like, you see a face of, like, of, like, disagreement. And for things, I do that too.
Josué:Like, I I can't control my face. I can't control my body in terms of reacting. It is I can't keep my my my reactions or my opinions.
Lara:I swear it's got no poker face.
Josué:No. No. No. No. No.
Josué:No poker face. I tried, but it's it's not there. Yeah. And so there was one time when Link hurt me so hard. When I came in, I honestly said that at that moment in time, Ready Player One was my favorite book.
Josué:That's all I said. I said it's my favorite book. And I don't remember how Link hurt me.
Link:I think I think my response was that's your favorite book?
Josué:That's a feeling like Yeah.
Link:Incredulity. I probably hammed it up a little bit. It was rude. It was stinky. It was a stinker move.
Link:And I do regret it. And I have apologized. And I apologize again.
Josué:Why did you do that?
Link:Because I Why
Josué:did regret it.
Link:Player one is a bad book. But that was not an appropriate response to someone saying it's my current favorite. That's not that's not a good move socially to somebody you want to build and maintain a relationship with.
Lara:Right. There's room for debate.
Link:And it's
Lara:one of the things I like and don't like about this book. But your favorite thing? Let me rip your heart out and stomp
Link:on that's sort of what it comes down to is it wasn't any sort of specific criticism in there. It was just you expressing that this whole piece of media was currently occupying a high position in your thoughts. And I went that whole thing, ew. I was like, no, that's awful. Don't do that.
Josué:I didn't say it was the best book ever written. I didn't say the prose was, you know, life changing. Didn't say the characters were incredible. All I said was
Link:No.
Lara:And all
Link:of those would have been way more interesting conversations to have.
Josué:Exactly. We
Link:can Much do better than just the pushback of that's your favorite of being like, no. Now you have to you I'm putting on my little king crown, and you must show me how worthy you are by picking a new favorite right now. Chip, chop, chip, chip, chop, chip, pick something good. It better be good. Or I'm gonna make the stinky face again.
Link:No, that's not nice. Don't do it. Don't do it, people.
Josué:So I'm exaggerating that, like, you hurt me part. Right? Like, like, that's that's not true. But I did feel severely judged. I felt judged so hard.
Josué:And I was like, woah, woah, woah. Like, I was self conscious about it for a while. I was like, what? Why? What does Link think of me now?
Josué:Like, what does Link think that a person
Link:Hilariously, I'm still over here like, so it's so cool. Love hanging out with him. Hope he thinks I'm smart and interesting.
Josué:But multiple times, I've been like, oh, yeah. No. I'm I'm doing this. I'm just exploring that and and that reaction. But again, it's not just you.
Josué:Right? Like like people do. This is this is an example. And I'm glad you brought it up beforehand because I did. This is good because I was afraid I was
Link:It's going a to really it's a good example. And it's something I think that, you know, we can laugh about as being a funny story of our blossoming friendship and coworker this. But yeah, yeah, I think I think it
Josué:I think after that.
Link:Yeah, I think yeah, no, I think legitimately, it's a really good thing to be able to point to and be like, I can see exactly where the misstep was. It's like, lesson learned. Don't do
Lara:that again. Thing to happen between people who are on a podcast that talk about how the media we care about is important to us and meaningful to our each other and ourselves. Right? So like, some of that is this is my favorite thing because I relate to this thing, and you just told me this thing I relate to and see myself in sucks. I mean, I
Link:think that was before we were using that sort of structure and how we were talking about geek therapy. And I I do think that that ties back into it. I think that is absolutely a a moment that for me was like, that wasn't cool. That was me not just misunderstanding you, but actively pushing away from attempting to understand you, which is the opposite of what we are trying to do and what we are talking about is beneficial within therapeutic and social working spaces.
Josué:Exactly.
Link:So, yeah, not a proud moment, but I do think it is both important to us as friends and also to the podcast as, as we've grown in talking about this stuff.
Lara:And and Link doesn't always do that kind of stuff. We've had conversations about getting back to Steven Universe, how Pearl is my least favorite character. I hate her. And and Link just showed off a tattoo of her their body. My Pearl Point tattoo.
Lara:Exactly. And we can have a conversation about that. And, like, I can see why Link likes Pearl. And Link called out some of the things of why I hate Pearl is because I see myself in Pearl and the things I don't like about Pearl. So
Josué:Yeah. The the well, like, it's it's not just like, oh, it's with your therapist, but also family, friends, like anybody. And so, I mean, that's why that's why it hurts. Mhmm. Yeah.
Josué:Right.
Link:If if somebody you fully do not give a shit about says, oh, that thing you like is stupid. It's like, well, you're stupid. I don't care. He's like, move on. That's water off a duck's back.
Link:But if it's somebody who's like, oh, well, I really care about your opinion and thoughts and criticisms of things and this one we are fully not connecting on and that that feels bad. That's a that's a missed social connection moment and that can be kind of scary if you aren't very secure in your social relationship with somebody. Interaction in, you know, more on the beginning of our relationship would be very different if that was, say, the first or second time meeting a therapist. Yeah.
Josué:Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah.
Lara:Which is interesting, like, the language that you use when describing things. Like, because what you were talking about, how somebody asked, like, what you thought of Deadpool and Wolverine, and you said you didn't like it. And they're like, oh, I don't wanna go see it then. Like, they cared about your opinion. Yeah.
Lara:Yeah. And then based their whole experience of this movie on your opinion.
Josué:So so I I'm sure this happens all the time, but, like, I and I'm curious how you feel about it. Lara in particular. Right? Like, I I think recently, talked about how the way that Mark talked about The Office, I feel about Hamilton. Right?
Josué:But, like, I know you like it. Right? I think you both do. Like, Mark and and Lara. I don't know about you, Link.
Josué:Link, have you seen Hamilton? No. You have. Okay. And you
Link:I have seen it. I'm lukewarm on it. Lukewarm.
Josué:But like I but I figured that you you guys like really liked it. And so I felt weird because I didn't want it to seem like I was yucking your yum. Right? Like I didn't like my goal is not to take a shit on on on what anybody likes, but I still feel I and I I I think I feel that I might have that effect because that's how I feel. Like, if somebody brings it up.
Josué:Right? Like, what the example that I always give about not really player one, a Phantom Menace in particular, when I'm talking about in a therapy context. It's like, if I say it's my favorite, you don't have to say anything. Mhmm. Like, if you don't like it, you don't have to tell me in that moment because then it feels like like like you were saying, like, if we're if we're just getting to know each other and you feel like this is the moment to tell me that we have very different opposing views on something, I'm like, then what's your what's your goal here?
Josué:Like, what's your like, that feels divisive.
Link:What's the follow-up move to that?
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. What's your intention? Mhmm. Did you wanna have a debate or like, again, like, oh, my favorite my favorite book is Ready Player One.
Josué:It's like, oh, hate that puck. That book? It's like, I even even just saying like, oh, I really don't like that one. It's like, yeah, like, you're you're in a position of power because you're my therapist or you're my teacher or something like that. Like, why are you why are you imposing that upon me that you don't like it?
Josué:Do do you do you all agree with that? Like, do you think there's something there? Do you feel the same way?
Lara:I mean, I think it's something it goes along with the same kind of things where therapists aren't supposed to share I mean, everybody has some levels I guess there are some therapists that don't self disclose, but the new fad in therapy is using some self disclosure. But it's a thing to not share big opinions on big things, right, on political things or religious things or whatever so that you can stay neutral for the client and they can build a relationship with you without having this opposing view. When it comes to media, especially things that I think I've told this story on the podcast before. I have a I have a client who really loved this country music artist, and I hate country music. And we spent an entire session geeking out and understanding why this client loved this artist, why they connected with this person and the music.
Lara:We listened to music in the session. And I was still able to light up and, like, smile and do the head nodding and, like, tell me more about this person. Because I think there are only a handful of things that I will shit on in that way where I just hate it. I will try to find the glimmers of the things that I like about something. And in this situation, it was, I like that this kid was able to tell me how this helped them get through these experiences that they had.
Lara:So I think it's important, even if you don't like a thing, if you respect the other person that you're talking to, to try and find something. Right? Even if it's their opinion of the thing and their love of the thing.
Link:Do you think some people struggle with that aspect in having very high internal value of authenticity. And there can be an element of if you don't like something, not immediately responding with I don't like that thing feels like you are doing something inauthentic. And for me, it's very much having to reframe that idea of authenticity where it's it's not so much I have to be authentic to my every opinion 100% of the time, loudly, vocally, everyone must know, and more about authentically valuing, sharing a moment with somebody and having that be the the more important aspect of the authenticity is that, like you said, find the little glimmer thing that you're like, well, that that part's cool. I like that. I'm interested in that.
Link:And focusing on that aspect as a way to maintain authenticity without being like, I must shit on that thing that you just said because I simply do not like it. It's like Mhmm. You can you can rework that a little bit.
Lara:Right. Right. And I think about, like, how let's say his favorite movie of Star Wars, favorite Star Wars movie, Phantom Menace. Phantom Menace is my least favorite Star Wars movie. However, I don't hate it.
Lara:Right? And there are things that, like, I really enjoy about that movie. In fact, I probably watched it more than my favorite movie, which is Return of the Jedi. So and people will tell me I'm wrong for saying my favorite is Return of the Jedi and that objectively, quote, unquote, it should be Empire Strikes Back. But whatever.
Marc:I I think for me, because I like, especially going into, like, all these types of things and learning about kind of everything that you guys have been talking about because of all my time I spent listening to these podcasts. I think now when, like, when I'm meeting with clients, even if there is something that, like, I personally do not vibe with or I'm just not that into, I think I try to approach every single situation, and I always come at their interests with that sense of curiosity because even though I may not like the thing, that's I understand that that's a me thing, and I do my best to not let that kinda come out. But instead, I say, okay. Well, tell me why you like that thing. I wanna hear what you're taking from it.
Marc:And I always do that in the sense of, maybe if they tell me something and what they're seeing, I might look back at it and say, okay. No. I see what they mean. And who knows? Then I might end up liking that thing.
Marc:Or it's a sense of like, okay. I have a newfound appreciation for that particular anime that they that they really enjoy watching and that they really relate to that maybe I didn't quite get into. Or it could be a a book series, something whatever it might be that they might be talking about. I try to approach it from more of that curiosity standpoint because whether I don't know much about it or I don't like it, that doesn't matter to me because I'm more focused on wanting to know what they are into and what they take from it and why they relate to it so much.
Josué:I want I wanna focus on the on the relatability piece. But first, I wanted to add something to to your authenticity comment link. It made me think of this concept that I learned, like, in the in the context of of white supremacy, which is the right to comfort.
Lara:Mhmm. Right?
Josué:Which is that people are like, I I should be the one that had that it feels like that it expresses their opinion. If I don't express my opinion, like, it's unfair or like, no, I want to make sure that
Link:feel uncomfortable when it's not about me.
Josué:Exactly. Exactly. So especially when you think about something like that, again, in in those relationships where it's an adult and a child, right? Or it's like your guardian or it's a teacher or it's your your therapist, right? And primarily that we we keep bringing that up.
Josué:It's like, do you why do you think that you have the right to comfort over this other person? Same with just like just saying if I tell you that you what you like, that I don't like what you like, now I feel better. Right? That's why I thought about it, like, because you were like, like, don't feel comfortable if I don't share my opinion. Like, is it is now the time?
Josué:Like, why why? What's what's happening? Mhmm. And and in terms of the relatability, I think I think that's that's the biggest piece of this, which is to some people, Ready Player One is just a book. But to me, it's more than that.
Josué:Right? To some people, a movie is just a movie. But for us, there are specific movies and books and songs that that are incredibly meaningful. Link, you have a a pearl tattoo. Brandon had a giant bat signal on his chest.
Josué:Mark has the Assassin's Creed symbol tattooed on his forehead. Like, we care about these things. And they are they're meaningful to us. My sister was telling me a story about, I think someone she met at work who got a a big tattoo. She said it covered their entire forearm.
Josué:And it was from a video game. And she goes, but from a video game? And it was so judging that, you know, I was like, so what is the problem exactly with the video game? You know? And we had a whole conversation about I'm sure she regretted every like, ever bringing it up.
Josué:But it's, like, it's meaningful to us. Right? Like, again, we never had that conversation about why why do I like Phantom Menace more than than any of the others? Why do I like Ready Player One so much? And and I know I saw this recently.
Josué:I don't I don't know if it's a if this was just this person's theory or if it's something like a like an academic theory that said that people like stories for one of three reasons. One is the the world setting. Right? So like that world building aspect. One is the plot, and the other is the characters.
Josué:And I thought about that. And and, like, I'm definitely a world building person. Like, I like and I know, like, I kind of ignore the other two or I care about them way less. So it's like, you know, it depends on what's happening. So so one of the things, like, with Deadpool and Wolverine, it's like there are laws and there are things happening there that bug me that have to do with the entire world and and the universe that they've built and the and the and the things that are going on to a lesser degree.
Josué:I hate some of the interactions with some of the characters. Reput it like it splits into different pieces. And and you've said the word relatable a bunch of times, Lara. Right? It's like, that struck a nerve with me.
Josué:And that's why I care more. Like, I feel it more than someone else because they haven't had my experiences, or they just don't care about that particular topic. And so, yeah, we don't we don't dive into those conversations. So I love that example, Laura, of, like, I don't like country music doesn't matter. Like, this person really cares about it.
Josué:If I learn that, then it's that I they they feel safer. They feel that, you know, I'm coming at it with curiosity, they will have a better relationship, but also you get to understand them better.
Lara:And sometimes not necessarily at that situation, could I because I'd never heard the artist before. But in most situations, I have an easier time connecting with people about things I don't like rather than things I don't have experience or don't know about. Collaborate. I am so I'm the kind of person who can find something that I like about pretty much anything I interact with. If I don't like I mean, let's see.
Lara:I'm trying to think of an example. Like, I turned off the Avatar the Last Airbender movie. Right? I turned it off ten minutes in.
Josué:Yeah.
Lara:There are so many things I don't like about it. Somebody comes to me and says it's the best thing ever, I might internally, like, die. But externally, I at least know about the movie and the things I didn't like and the things that I could like if I had given it a chance maybe, like having the live action visuals. Right? Getting to see it in a different way.
Lara:But if I haven't experienced something at all, I had a client bring up a show I had never seen oh, I had a client bring up the bear when I hadn't watched it yet, and I didn't really get what she was talking about. I was listening to what she was saying, and there was a cool scene that she talked about dealing with anxiety and life sucking. So I went to go watch it, and I binged the entire show. I loved it a lot. But I had an easier time connecting with something I did not like when somebody talks about it than something I have no experience because I have no context.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Man, I I just come at it with a lot of curiosity. So, like Mhmm.
Josué:I usually these conversations, whichever way they go I've also I've also started doing, like, if if nobody asked me for my opinion, I'm I'm I'm like, I don't give it.
Link:That's pretty smart. That's pretty smart, man.
Marc:That that's a very enlightened skill you've had
Link:sage like.
Josué:Just life has been a lot smoother.
Link:Wisdom roll on that one.
Josué:Yeah. Do do you want my pen? Do you want advice? Do you want like, no? Cool.
Josué:Yep.
Lara:Yeah.
Josué:Not gonna give it. But give it back to
Lara:the the language that we use. Right? Like, just because I said I have an easier time doing something, right, doesn't mean that I can't do it if it's something that I don't experience, so that kind of thing.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. I was gonna I was gonna say something. I think it had to do with, like, just our our perspective on on things and and, like, adding to the to the piece of what we care about. Like, there are pieces that, like, mean something to us and some that don't.
Josué:But we also see media in in different ways. I can't remember exactly what I was gonna bring up about that. There was an example that from what you were saying, Lara.
Lara:That was about Avatar and
Josué:Oh, you were saying Avatar. Okay. There you go. Like, example that I think of is that people get really a lot of people I know really care about source material or original. Right?
Josué:And I am fortunate that I see alternate versions of something as just an alternate version of something. Right? So, like, if we're talking about the original Avatar movie, the live action, to me, it's not it doesn't damage. I don't think it insults. I don't think it does anything negative to the source material itself or my experience of that source material.
Josué:When a book gets adapted into a movie, like, a lot of people get hung up on it. And, like, it's hard not to think about it. But also, like, I'm pretty good at keeping those connected. And I usually bring up the Batman example. Right?
Josué:Like, there's always multiple versions of Batman of of Batman's going on. Right? There's a a Lego version. There's two animated version. There's I mean, we just had two live action versions going on at the same time.
Josué:Like, still had technically, I mean, in the Flash movie, we had three. Yeah. Three plus the the other movie, the Pattinson movie had already come out in theaters. So, like, I if it's not faithful like, the Michael Key in Batman is so unfaithful to the comics. Right?
Josué:It's so so unfaithful. But it's just a different a different version. And so for me, that that that part of it, like, it makes it easy for me to, like, just enjoy a lot of things. Right? Like like, Deadpool and Wolverine, I'm not thinking about comic books.
Josué:Right? I'm not comparing it to different versions of those characters. I'm not thinking anything like that. And and, yeah, and I know a lot of people, like, that is a sticking point. And I don't understand why exactly.
Josué:Like, can't
Lara:Sometimes that's just how their brain works. I have a friend who we did this summer, we did Scared Girl Summer and watched a bunch of horror movies, and my friend really wanted to watch The Grudge. Mhmm. Would not watch the remake. Mhmm.
Lara:Had to go find at a secondhand DVD store the original grudge with Sarah Michelle Gellar in it for us to watch before we could watch any of the sequels. It was he found it. Like, it was great, but that's just how his brain works.
Josué:Yeah. I like comparing. Like like, sure, there are things that I'm like, there's no reason to remake that. Please don't remake it. Right?
Josué:If I have, like, fun memories of it, I do have that that instinct. But then but, like, once there are remakes, if it it's it's something that I really like or something I'm really interested in, I like comparing the different the different versions of stuff.
Lara:How many different Legend of Zelda games that we have and versions of Link. Right?
Josué:Yeah. Well, those those are alternate stories. Right? I'm thinking like, well, one that just came to mind is
Link:Sometimes. Right. Sometimes. Everything you say about The Legend of Zelda always comes with an asterisk. Uh-huh.
Link:Uh-huh. Except when it's not.
Josué:What is there was a movie that came out a few years ago, Bradley Cooper and Lady Gaga. Do you remember?
Marc:A star is
Josué:born? A star is born. Yeah. A star is born. I think that was a fifth time that someone has made a star is born.
Josué:It's either the fourth or fifth time. And I was like, why does this movie keep getting remade? So I went back and watched some of the the the other ones. Like, I'm just I'm just interested. Right?
Josué:Like, there's one in the fifties or sixties, I think. Yeah. For fact checking me fact checking me now. Right? There's I know there's multiple versions.
Josué:And so, like, that that kind of thing, I find I find interesting. Again, if I care enough about it to how many?
Lara:One, two, three, four, I think four. And one of them has Judy Garland in it.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I told you.
Josué:Yeah. That's it's That's like So the latest one is the fourth one or the fifth one?
Lara:73. Wait. 73. Okay. 37 Uh-huh.
Lara:54 Uh-huh. 73, 76, and 2 2018.
Josué:So
Lara:The other one had Barbara Streisand. Like
Josué:Yeah. The one before. Yeah. So I was right. So it was five versions.
Josué:Right? I'm like, yeah. No. Let me I wanna see five versions of this. Just like, I mean I mean, you know, we're all like, I I wonder, you know, someone younger, they're like, oh, there's a little mermaid movie come out.
Josué:And somebody's like, oh, there's an animated version that it's based on. Oh, yeah. Let's check it out. I'm sure that a lot of people haven't seen Snow White, which came out in the thirties. Right?
Josué:So
Lara:But then there's, like, Snow White and the Huntsman, and there's the new Snow White movie coming out. And
Josué:Right. Right. Yes. Yes. Right.
Josué:So that's like there's the animated Disney version, and this new live action is is is that. But there's also the original story that's been retold many, many times. Like, do remember the Fables comics? Did interview Mhmm. Read that?
Josué:Like, I I used to love love those because it's just a reimagining of everything. Like, the Snow White story was horrible.
Lara:Yeah. Most of the most of those were horrible.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But but yeah. I mean, again, I enjoy that.
Josué:I don't feel like it's it's insulting. Sure. One is one I may want like one better than the other. One may objectively be better than the other. People will say.
Josué:But like that that part doesn't yeah. Again, luckily, it doesn't really bother me. We'll see. We'll see if they remake the matrix. We'll see how I feel about that.
Lara:Matrix rebooted. That'll be the next one.
Marc:What if they do a remake of the live action Dragon Ball z movie? Evolution? Yeah.
Josué:It's so funny that even the main so so the two two of the actors in that movie have, like, apologized to Akira Toriyama. Right? So so one is the guy who played Spike, I forgot, in Buffy. I forgot his name. He played Piccolo in the movie.
Josué:Yeah. James Marshers. And I think he did the movie for free. I forgot I forgot the exact story, but he did the movie for free for some reason. And then, like, he he has apologized publicly, and then the guy who played Goku has also apologized.
Josué:I think I remember that. Like, I think I remember hearing about that. And that and, again, like, that movie, I do not like. And it has nothing to do with like, I don't I don't like it in general. Right?
Josué:Like, there's some I'm trying to think of a movie that is just so different from the source material, but I'm but I'm okay with it because, like, it's it's a it's just it's just just like a very different interpretation of it. Again, I can't I mean, I have
Marc:a I have a movie that comes to mind, but I've already talked about it enough. Is this Percy Jackson? It is Percy Jackson, the sea of monsters. Oh, boy. That one.
Marc:Yeah. That one was rough. And I think I remember when you were talking about it, like, I I think at the time I went hard. I was like, this was just I think I also said it was objectively bad, which I look back on. I'm like, I mean, some people might really, really like it, and that's not that's not my place to to judge it.
Marc:That's not my place to say anything about it. Like, if that if that is a movie that you enjoy, then great. By all means, enjoy it. I as a a person that has read the books and has obviously seen this has read the source material numerous times before even seeing the movies, I had a much very I had a very different opinion about those things. And even with the first movie, like, I remember a lot of people in the fan base, like, hating on the movie.
Marc:Even the author was hating on the movie. And to me, I'm like, is this is this true to the source material loosely? Is it still a movie that's like, you know, you watch it and it's enjoyable? Like, you know, it's got its action. It's got its thing.
Marc:Like, if if you're just looking for a good movie, like, just like, you know, good kill, good hour and a half, it's great. I enjoyed it. But for different reasons other than, like, this is because it's it's because of Percy Jackson. It's like, no. This is just, on its own, like, an enjoyable movie to watch.
Josué:Yeah. There was a trope, which now I think is way happens way less. But was that, like, they would take the source material and then isekai the characters into the real world. Right? So I'm thinking, like, the first time I remember seeing this I mean, it's happened other many other times, but the first time I remember was the He Man movie.
Josué:You remember this, Lara? Dolph Lundgren, He Man, and the masters of the it was called masters of the universe. And it's a live action movie, which I remember liking very much. But He Man gets just, like, pulled into our Earth. Right?
Josué:And that that kind of thing used to happen all the time. I was talking to a friend recently about the Warcraft movie that came out a few years ago. And I made a comment, like, had that movie come out twenty years ago, there would have been someone playing Warcraft on the computer. They got sucked into the game somehow and then was in that world or vice versa. And I mean, technically, Sonic the Hedgehog, the the Sonic movies have done this.
Josué:Like, they pulled him out of his world, and it all takes place on Earth.
Lara:Mhmm.
Josué:Which, I mean, if you look at Sonic Adventure, it's like it's not it's not completely out of, you know, source material type of things that we don't get. Like, we get, like, five minutes of of, you know, the game world, and then the rest of it happens on Earth. So very different from from the games, but but I I still enjoy those. I still I still like them because I think it's taking what I a lot of the things that I like about that and just I'm okay that it's happening here, and it's not happening in another world. It's fine.
Josué:Plus, there are other versions of that. There's, like, four or five different animated series that explore the different worlds. There was actually do do you guys remember Lara, do you remember when Sonic the Hedgehog had a TV show on, like, on Saturday mornings? Remember like but there were two simultaneously. One one was an action adventure, and the other one was a comedy.
Josué:And the the, like, more comedy Looney Tunes like one was based on the comic books that were released at the time. And then the other version was, like, Sonic was part of a resistance, and and it was it was much more serious. And they they both they both played at the same time. They're both going on. And I don't know.
Josué:Things like that, I think, helped me appreciate that they're they're different versions. Like, there can be different versions. And maybe one version for maybe some people like the one and they don't like the other and, like, we get to have things that we enjoy. Anyway, I've I've tried to use I I think I'm getting better at using the language that I feel is very not yum yucking.
Link:Something I want to touch on talking about the language stuff is that we as human beings are more sensitive to negative stimuli than positive stimuli. And so hearing somebody gushing about how great something is is not as neurologically impactful as somebody saying this is the worst thing ever. And so I do think that our language around it, around expressing the things that we like and dislike about various media properties is related to that way that our our, you know, English language works in that, you know, if you look at like news, negative stuff gets promoted and spread around way faster, way more than positive stuff. And so I think that same thing happens where it's both it is louder, but it is also, more hurtful when we are on the receiving end of hearing something negative like that because it feels our brain is like that's that's more important. You have to listen to it.
Link:Three people agreed with you that that thing was great, but one person said it was bad and now you have to focus on that one person.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. But in I'm curious. So so I think that explains why, at least on on social media, right, like people people like the the discourse is usually very negative.
Link:Yes.
Josué:Doesn't matter how good, like, reviews may be or or what the consensus is. The negative voices are are louder. They get the most engagement, which then social media platforms elevate because they have more engagement.
Lara:It gets put in like a repeating
Josué:Yeah. Feeds itself.
Link:A vicious cycle.
Josué:Yeah. But do you but so it gives the impression that there's more negativity than positivity. But why like, why do you think people have the we we talked earlier about the example of, like, just having a reaction. I know a couple weeks ago, Lara, you said something and I was like, ew. And then I felt bad about it.
Lara:And then he messaged me later. I should not yuck your yum. Right?
Josué:I I did. Right. Yeah. And so sometimes it's like, it's just a reaction. Right?
Josué:Like, in the moment. Mhmm. But a 600 word Reddit post or a Twitter, you know, like 10 tweets in a row are more
Lara:some time.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I can't take back saying, ew.
Josué:Right? Link can't take back judging me harshly and hurting my soul and my feelings. But we could, like, delete a post. We could take it back. Right?
Josué:But people don't. Right? So so why do you think people feel that need to and maybe we've covered a little bit as before, but, like, why do people feel that need to express how much they hated something?
Link:Mean, I think it's a couple of interconnected systems at play here. I think, you know, on the like I like I was saying is, you know, human brains prioritize negative stuff. And so I think there's just simply that aspect that our our brains naturally put more resources into, like, this thing could be bad. It could hurt you in some way. I have to protect you.
Link:We have to focus on it. I I think there's also, like you're saying, the social media aspect. We have very much set up all of our social media platforms highly reward negative engagement. I think that interconnected to social media is also our offline social aspects. Those interconnect with each other all the time.
Link:And so the ways that, you know, social media and Twitter increases the, you know, doing your your two eighty word dunk on the new movie that just dropped on Netflix to get the 6,000 likes or whatever also feeds back into our regular spaces at workplaces or with friend groups or whatever. If I say the judgy mean thing and get a laugh out of it or if somebody agrees with me, then that is social capital I'm earning. And then feeding back into, we are taught that that is a good thing to have that kind of interaction through both real life and social media online. Yeah. A lot of interconnected systems.
Josué:I did just experience the, like, the community aspect, I'll call it, of, like, going back to Deadpool and Wolverine. I went to I went to Rotten Tomatoes, and I had a 79%. I'm like, oh, that that's good. Like, that's the like, a vast majority of critics think think that it's good. So I was like, am I crazy?
Josué:Like, you have no idea how much I'm obsessed about not liking this movie. I had a friend recently be like, you're you're talking about this too much. Like, you need to like, you are seriously, like, upset about the fact that you don't like this movie. So I've been overthinking it. And and so I went and I I read only the negative reviews on on Rotten Tomatoes.
Josué:And then I felt like I wasn't alone. I felt like, oh, I'm not crazy. These people all of these negative reviews share my my opinions. And then obviously, they're weighing those things more than the other things. There's a lot of things that I like about the movie.
Josué:But then at the end, when it's like, I can go through all the things that I like, and there's a lot of them. But ultimately, it's like, did you like it? It's like, oh, no. I did not. I did not.
Josué:And it's only like, it could be just like 10% of it, but that 10% weighs a lot for me. But I did just have that experience. I don't think I'd ever gone into something to read the negative reviews just so I didn't feel like, alone in the world, in my opinion. And I did. I went into, maybe I can share the link with you guys.
Josué:I went to Reddit, and I was looking for, like, I did not like the movie. And then someone wrote and and again, I think I think the language was great. It was, I really like the movie, but there are a lot of things that I didn't like about it. I'm curious to just, like, list the things that you didn't like. Just, like, setting it up that way, I thought was great.
Josué:And for the most part, it was pretty civil. And and I don't usually write ad to to to Reddit, but I did a pretty lengthy list of things on there. But I felt it felt like a like a again, the context of it. And I use that language every time of like, this made me feel this way. I didn't like this.
Josué:Like, and and that was it. I never said, this sucked. This is garbage. This is not okay. Objectively bad, etcetera.
Josué:So I think I think, yeah, there is good discourse out there. But another thing to keep in mind on the social media thing is, like, well, if you're talking about reviewers, like, some people, it's their job to review stuff. And so, you know, like, the professional critics on you know, they get counted in Rotten Tomatoes. I think, you know, they can give their own opinion, and it doesn't really matter either way. But on YouTube, like, it's their job to get views, right, like you were saying, like, and so the more inflammatory their their their language sometimes there's just, like, clickbait in the titles.
Lara:Mhmm.
Josué:Right? And, like, their opinion is pretty it may be even mostly positive or just, like, in the middle. But then the the, you know, the title of the video will be something like, is the Marvels the worst Marvel movie ever?
Lara:Yep.
Josué:I the reviews like, I actually liked it.
Link:Yeah. Is that is one system I didn't touch on is that these production people making media that they want you to consume, it is very much part of their job to connect a brand with your identity. And so having inflammatory posts online, where then you get a bunch of people pushing back against that, that is top tier engagement that they are looking for. So from the perspective of the marketer, people saying that the thing is the shittiest worst thing that they've ever seen is still useful beneficial promotion for their thing And they encourage that kind of engagement, which is not beneficial for us as social beings who need to get along with each other. But it makes
Lara:somebody Publicity a lot of is better than no publicity. Yeah.
Josué:Yeah. And what is it? If it if it bleeds, it leads. Mhmm. Is that the is that the term?
Link:Yes. I think these are all connected. Yeah.
Josué:Yep. So it's not it's nothing new that you can even you can just play the character of somebody who hates things. And if you get enough of a following enough engagement, you can get brand deals. You can live off of that. And a lot of people do, right?
Josué:Like, we we've how often do you find people like, oh, yeah. No. I mean, you know, I was was playing it up for the audience. I don't really feel that way or another or, like, you don't believe at all, and they're just playing like, no. It's just a job.
Josué:I don't know.
Link:Just trying to meet the criteria to get my stuff actually on the front page of YouTube. I have to post the inflammatory screenshot because that's how the app works. It's like, Oh, right. This is fucked.
Josué:Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Well, any closing thoughts on this, Mark?
Marc:I think that this was a much needed conversation because as you I'm sure we like, you guys are mentioning just not that long ago how, like, we tend to have, like, these kind of gut reactions sometimes when someone mentions something and we have a, like, a very strong opinion about it, typically with negative opinions. And even myself, like, that's something that I'd work hard to, like, try to catch myself doing. And I'm kinda like you, Jose, where I try to make sure that I'm not just, like, openly just crapping on something and trying to emotionally damage these people by just telling them how god awful their choices are in books, for example, or or movies or anything like that. So I think this is a really great conversation to have, as a good way to kind of remind myself, like, be to be a little bit more mindful of the language that I am using when I am talking about a particular piece of media and, like, my own opinions of it as opposed to trying to say that something is objectively bad or telling someone that they're wrong for liking or disliking something. Yeah.
Marc:Lara?
Lara:I think the bottom line is okay to disagree with people. It's okay to have a different opinion. Just like I said earlier, if you respect the people you're talking to, don't shit on the thing that they like. And it's okay to have a conversation about why you like something and don't like something and connect in that way. Yeah, I think that's that's my thoughts.
Josué:Link?
Link:I guess my final thought is ultimately, language is a tool that we use to express ideas and thoughts and feelings. And media is also a tool that we use to express thoughts and ideas and feelings and stories. And so they're imperfect. You're going to mess up. And that's okay.
Link:Just be compassionate towards yourself and others, and do the best you can. And don't don't do free PR for the marketing business people. Fuck them.
Lara:Now if they'll pay you for your YouTube channel, get that get get your bag.
Josué:Get that money. Get that get that money.
Link:Yeah. Don't be a shit talker for free. Get paid.
Lara:Exactly. Exactly. That's that's my final takeaway.
Josué:Yep. Media matters. Words matter. Conversations about why you like or don't like something can be really great.
Link:They're always gonna be more interesting than just if a thing is good or bad. Why you like something is so much more interesting.
Josué:Yep. And why you
Link:dislike Why you dislike. Yes. Exactly. The the the yeah. Yum.
Link:The the nitty gritty down deep stuff. That's what I want.
Josué:Exactly. So, you know, use that as a conversation starter. Don't end it right at the beginning with like, that's
Link:stupid. That's your favorite?
Josué:Thanks, Luke. Maybe one day, we'll actually have a conversation about why I
Link:like We did we did though. We did talk about it. You did describe to me, and it did actually retroactively make me give Ready Player One a little bit more leeway than I had originally because I did I saw what you what you saw in it, and that was good. Yeah.
Josué:Well, see see how well that turned out? See, you just gotta give it a chance. You can even fix it after someone stabs you in the back.
Link:It'll give you a fun anecdote for the next five years of podcasting.
Josué:Mark, if you get a chance, put in the you know, look up which episode that happened on, and we can
Marc:I have to go back to my mental archives here?
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Lara:There is an episode we talked about Ready Player One. I don't know if it was the movie or not. Yeah.
Josué:No. It was it was out of context. Like, the the the episode wasn't the context wasn't the actual
Link:That was later. That was when I got a handle on my My little stinker vibes. I got a got a leash on there.
Josué:Oh, that's so funny. Well, let us know, what you think of this topic. If you have ever yucked somebody's yum or somebody yucked your yum. What kind of languages do you use? Share your experiences in any of our community spaces.
Josué:For more geek therapy visit geektherapy dot org. Remember to geek out and do good. I'll be back next week.
Link:Bye.
Josué:Geek therapy is a five zero one c three nonprofit organization dedicated to making the world a better place through geek culture. To learn more about our mission and become a supporter visit geektherapy.org.
