Start at Level One: Easing Into New Roles, One Quest at a Time
Welcome to GT Radio on the Geek Therapy Network. Here at Geek Therapy, we believe that the best way to understand each other and ourselves is through the media we care about. My name is Josue Cardona, and I am joined by Link Keller. Hello. Lara Taylor.
Lara:Hey.
Josué:Lara, what have you been up to lately?
Lara:Same old stuff. Oh, wait. No. No. I've been trying some new things.
Lara:What? So last week, I got to DM my first D and D game that I've d Oh. I've played I've a bunch of been putting it off for a very long time. Let's see. I've been playing games with Cas Gamers since 2020, and keep saying, maybe I'll run a game.
Lara:Maybe I'll run a game. Maybe I'll run a game. And I got really self conscious about it. So I decided to DM a game, just one on one, with my wife Nina. And it actually went pretty well.
Lara:It was a good experience. It was a lot of fun. There was a lot of laughter. And yeah, I just it was a good way to think about a bunch of different things. Like I said, trying new things and also looking at things from a different perspective.
Lara:So, yeah.
Josué:Basically. My maybe I don't know you that well. I thought I've known you for a while, but I can't imagine you DMing. I can't I can't picture I can't picture it at all.
Lara:That's the funny thing. Right? And also, we're the same person, Hosway. Can you picture yourself DMing a game?
Josué:I don't. I don't know. I don't I don't think so.
Link:I have no problem picturing either of you as doing doing DM work. I think you would both be good at it.
Lara:Think And
Josué:you really don't know us.
Link:No. I just say, I think people put a lot of, like, extra, like, anxiety around it because it feels like, oh, I'm in charge, but Mhmm. It doesn't actually have to be that way. Charge.
Josué:That's that's the that's the part of it, right, where I'm like, I I I do not associate, like, stepping forward and assuming responsibility with Lara. Like, taking control with Lara. I'm like, no.
Lara:I can get shit done.
Josué:But Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, like, like, just like you stepping forward and being like, I'm going to lead this game. Like, I I I can't. I can't.
Josué:So this is this is definitely new for you.
Lara:Oh, definitely new except okay. So when I was, like 14, 15, I ran some Vampire the Masquerade, Werewolf the Apocalypse games for friends. And I think that's when my creativity was at its peak, was around that time. And then things kind of got lost along the way, and I got jaded. But having been playing a lot of role playing games lately, and being more creative, I decided I wanted to take a jump.
Lara:And the easiest way for me to do that was I'm running the essentials kit, which I played with both of you.
Link:Mhmm. You.
Lara:And and I've had this plan Most of it.
Josué:Most of it.
Lara:I had this plan to do I was gonna run this with Nina after we finished playing. And we were never gonna have that last session with Brandon. So I was like, I'm just gonna do this. And I kinda wanted to take a stab at playing one on one and see how it works. Because there are rules in that set to play one on one.
Lara:Just because I I think most of the work I do with clients is one on one. And so I wanted to see if I could actually make this work and do one on one work with D and D. It's your wife,
Link:so the stakes are a little lower.
Lara:Stakes are a little lower, but still, there's like there was a lot of nerves going into it beforehand. But the interesting thing is the plan was I was going to we were gonna finish our run, the three of us, with Brandon. And then I was going to, you know, run the game for Nina and then have her listen to the podcast that only has a couple episodes. But I hear I hear GT Adventures is getting a reboot, just not with the same people or same story. So that's exciting.
Lara:Yeah.
Josué:I mean, now that you're DMing, maybe you could finish the game. We could finish the game with you. We just need one we just need one more episode to wrap it up.
Lara:Maybe. There's a little more left in there than Brandon told us.
Josué:Okay. I mean I mean, I think part of the and I and I'm curious because, like like, you say you could imagine either of us doing it. I can the only way I can imagine me doing it would be with, like, two months of preparation. And I would have, like I wouldn't map out so many different things. It would require, you know Clarify my previous statement.
Josué:I don't necessarily think that Dungeons and Dragons is necessarily the best or most DM version I picture you guys as. I think both of you would enjoy other games game types more
Link:Yeah. The DM position. But I don't I don't I don't, like, doubt either of your guys' skill at being able to DM in fifth edition. It's it's also become a lot easier than, like,
Lara:when I'm a person who's
Link:DMing would require more more prep Yeah. Or willingness to just straight up, like, not add any flare onto anything and just take stuff straight out of a book, is a fine way to play if that's the way that you like to play. It's not
Lara:And that's kind of what I'm doing. I'm kind of taking what was in the book and putting different flares on it than Brandon did. Right? I couldn't bring myself to bring Gum Gum into the into the world. But it's it's very interesting seeing Nina go to different places than we went first, and having her interact with different people in very different ways.
Lara:So we've only done one of the adventures, one of the little quests that the three of us did. But it was very interesting. Like I said, seeing it from a different perspective, reading through what is in manual to kind of figure out how things are gonna go. That was interesting to see. She did the one with the manticore, which is actually really easy as far as building out like, stat blocks and things.
Lara:Like, it was it's one one enemy.
Josué:That thing almost killed me.
Link:Had no more fight.
Josué:Thought it almost killed me.
Lara:And I also I also, knowing what happened to us, I steered Nina that direction before going to the other ones, because I almost died in our first session. So that she's learning from the She's gaining the benefit of what I've learned, right? And I'm kinda steering her in a direction. But it was a lot of fun. Her choices are so ridiculous.
Lara:Her character is a rogue, basically, like a Robin Hood, like a Disney's Robin Hood type, like, con man, but also, like, very charming. Decided to play a very short dragonborn named Nada Kobold. Not a co bold. Nice. So this is the vibes we're going for in this game.
Lara:And once I got into it, I was it was fine. I'm a little nervous about some of the other encounters because there's a lot more moving parts and remembering where things are supposed to go and moving those things or remembering if she doesn't wanna go to this room, I have to figure out a way to move that piece of information somewhere else because I don't like the idea of forcing players to do things like a certain way and trying to be more flexible about things. But at first, the anxiety was, oh shit, I'm the one who has to come up with I'm like, give me a perception check. I'm like, oh, fuck. I have to figure out what that means.
Lara:Here is I what's the DC of something? I don't know. Luckily, the DM screen that comes with the essentials kit has like, everything you need to know on the back of it. But still, I think I also was a pushover because it's it's my wife, and I didn't wanna be mean to her. So she got away with a lot of things.
Lara:That's a
Link:legitimate DM strategy, and don't you talk down about it.
Lara:I did I did let her get away with a lot of things. One of the things I found interesting was this scenario, It the quest and I knew this was gonna frustrate her going in, which is also nice playing with if you're first time DM ing, going and playing with someone you know and you know what their responses are gonna be. Because it's the one where the quest says, bring this person back to town. And in the book, it tells you, as the DM, this person will never go back to town. And the goal is to get them to write a note.
Lara:So that was a lot of fun to just sit and banter with her back and forth and back and forth. And at a certain point, I'm like, we need to go to bed. So I was super nice to her, and had the NPC that I made up to go around with her point out, hey, couldn't we just get her to sign something? Because it was just us talking in circles, which happens in real life too. So yeah, it's very interesting seeing the different roles, and sitting in those different seats.
Lara:And this is the first time I've played D and D in person in three and a half years.
Link:I was gonna ask, did you use any maps, or pieces, or anything?
Lara:We did. Got Oh, yeah. Some dry erasements, I drew stuff out, it was not that great, but she still understood what was going on on the maps. I had I had backed a Kickstarter in like 2024 in 2019. That was little flat.
Josué:Like acrylic, right?
Lara:Little acrylic like mini figs that are super custom. And Hero Forge actually now has the flat acrylic ones that you can do instead of having to get the big ones printed that cost a lot more. But it was really nice. I got to move around pieces on a board instead of like just imagine things. So it was a lot of fun and a lot of fun to do a new thing.
Lara:And I don't like to do thing new things that are gonna be super stressful for me. So it was a lot of fun.
Josué:How long have you wanted to DM? I
Lara:mean, that was the whole reason we got in. So we started playing with a friend of ours, and with a few other friends actually, and my nephew, and Jessica, a friend of the show, and part of the GT family, was in that game. And the reason we started that game earlier in 2019 was so that I could learn to DM from a friend of ours. And that game kind of fell apart once the pandemic hit. So since 2019, I think I'd been thinking about it a little more.
Lara:Again, I hadn't been comfortable playing RPGs for ten years before the three of us played with Brandon. And then everything kind of just I pushed a little rock down a hill, and it became a boulder building, picking up all the moss down the way. And now I play all the games. And I'm running D and D, and I'm planning on running an Avatar game for my nephew and Nina and maybe a friend of ours.
Josué:Okay. So now that you've done it, right, like so so first of all, I mean, it's it's a new thing. You've wanted to do it for a while. Mhmm. Finally did it.
Josué:And like you said, you're doing it in a way that is pretty I'm it feels safe. Right? It's
Lara:small It's
Josué:a smaller scale. Right? And it's also something that you already did before. Mhmm. So you're kind of familiar with it.
Lara:So I already know what's gonna happen. And if I had to, I could just fall back on what the book says or fall back on what Brandon did.
Josué:So Yeah. You you also went with the essentials kit, which is built as a beginner, like, as your first as your first D and D game. You didn't go with, you know, something
Lara:Curse of Strahd.
Josué:Or something from, like, second edition or something. I don't know if that's, like, something else.
Lara:Absolutely not. Absolutely not.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, all those sound like good tactics to do a new thing.
Lara:Mhmm.
Josué:What what were your fears about doing it?
Lara:That I would sit down and forget everything that I know about Dungeons and Dragons. Okay. That I mean, it's always that thing, like, when you get in front of a at least for me, when I get in front of a group of people, I get really nervous that I'm gonna fumble over my words and forget everything I wanted to say, that I am gonna look stupid. And one of the things that, like you said, it was nice to have Nina doing it because, I mean, we fight, but I don't think she ever thinks I'm stupid and would never say so to my face. But one thing she told me when I was like, oh, I'm getting a little nervous.
Lara:She was like, this is no judgment zone. Even yourself. No judging yourself. And that was really helpful to have that.
Josué:It's a good reminder.
Lara:Yeah. Mhmm. And just like someone told us when we were like prepping for our wedding and planning things, they told us, you know, nobody will know if something goes wrong unless you say it's going wrong. And I think that's something, like, behind this the DM screen, I can make anything happen and just like, oh, whatever. I didn't just kill you with that die roll.
Lara:Yeah. That misses.
Josué:Didn't have That do is a good point. I mean, in this case in particular, nobody else knows. I mean, it that that applies in a lot of stuff, but no one would know that you made a mistake.
Lara:Mhmm.
Josué:Unless you told them.
Lara:Or unless you did something unless you had a a rules lawyer y type player who knows all the things and would get you more on, like, rules rather than, like, story.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. True. True. Okay.
Josué:So how do you feel now that you've that you've done this new thing?
Lara:Nervous for the next time?
Josué:Okay. Okay. Less nervous, more nervous?
Lara:Less nervous. Different nervous. I think this one is more I know that the the next few quests have a lot more moving parts and a lot more things to remember and a lot more things to have to flip through. So it's just going to be a lot of extra stuff. And I also was not that great at preparing beforehand.
Lara:So and I yeah. I I I definitely will take time before we play next time to review the couple of quests that she could go to and do. So that's things that I would like to do. Be more prepared the next Yeah. But, yeah.
Lara:It was a lot of fun. I thought I I was also our DM for the game that we play with Kayla does a lot of voices, and I refuse to do voices. So I told Nina, don't be don't be prepared for that, because it's not gonna happen.
Josué:I can't imagine you doing voices.
Lara:Absolutely not. No. I don't do voices for
Josué:any reason. Eventually, but I can't. The Lara the Lara of now.
Link:Was that was always my my most nervousness anxiety in DMing and playing is that, like, I love the idea of doing character voices, but I do not have the stamina to maintain it for more than
Lara:a sentence
Link:before it's gone in the wind. Yeah. Yeah. But, you know, it doesn't have to be like that. You don't have to do voices.
Link:People will play with you in the space that you build for them.
Josué:Mhmm. You can use a voice modulator. Way I
Link:can do that.
Lara:Really wanna
Link:make doing that one online. Yeah.
Josué:Yeah. That worked out for me. That before. Mhmm. Yeah.
Lara:Playing a droid in a Star Wars game. Yeah.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. This is good.
Josué:Has the has is there anything like, are you on a trying new things streak? Is this is this something No. That's like a standout right now? Okay.
Lara:This is a standout right now. I mean, honestly, when you think about it, like, trying new things. We're doing a kitchen remodel. I've never done that. I've never had to deal with contractors in my house.
Lara:That's a whole new thing. But like, as far as like, trying new things, I started crocheting last year. That's the newest thing other
Josué:than It's a new thing. Yeah. It's a new thing. Okay. Okay.
Josué:Yeah. Any parallels? That's pretty geeky.
Lara:I mean, it's pretty geeky, but it's also a thing that, like,
Link:teaches you that you are not as good at math as you thought you were.
Lara:Oh, it's so bad. That's both of them.
Josué:Yeah. That's the diagram
Link:overlap is discovering you are not as good at basic math as thought you were.
Lara:Yeah. Yeah. I think the other thing with that is the, like, with the DM ing. Right? I'm been in the player's seat.
Lara:I've seen it from the player's position. The exact same encounters, just with a little bit different flair. Right. And different players bringing different things to it. And then sitting in the DMs role where I'm like, I'm deciding what checks need to be made.
Lara:I'm deciding what the difficulty on those are. I'm deciding what how the other characters are going to respond with crocheting. It's like different perspectives for me. I've watched my sister crochet for a really long time. My mom tried to teach me when I was like nine or 10, and I could not do shit.
Lara:I couldn't do anything. It was it looked horrible. And my sister has been crocheting a lot of different things for my entire life. And like watching her do stuff and make things as she started getting into making more stuffed animal type projects. I'm like, I want to do that.
Lara:And then the pandemic happened. And then I was like, so maybe I have been constraining for like two years now. But yeah, it's been a lot of fun to actually pick up the thing and like make progress on it, and look like, oh, I can make a thing. I'm looking up at my desk, I have a goblin that I made that has a little bag that can put dice in it. It's really cool.
Lara:So that's a different perspective that I have too, that I couldn't do the thing before, but I've watched my sister do something and just been fascinated with how quickly she can move the crochet hook and how quickly she can make stuff. And I thought I'd never be able to do that. And then I picked it up one day and
Josué:I was
Lara:crocheting up. I think it took me like two weeks to make this stuffed animal, which is really fast for someone first
Josué:making Yeah. Yeah. Well, those are things that you wanted to do. The kitchen remodel is something you kinda have to do. It's not something you wanted to do.
Lara:No. But yeah, things I've wanted to do. That's the thing. And in life, when I think about like, I went to therapy, right? I sat in the client role.
Josué:Mhmm.
Lara:And then now I am a therapist. And I sit in both roles just at different times.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Is there anything new that you've tried lately, Link? Or do you remember the last time you got into a new thing, something new that you had to either had to do or wanted to do? Nope.
Link:I don't I don't have any. I don't have an answer right now. I'm sure there is one. I just say nothing is
Lara:nothing's made it past brain juices. Something's made
Link:it past the brain worms.
Josué:Yeah. For me, I was thinking about it, and it was when also pandemic, I got into the model making.
Link:Yeah. You were doing
Josué:the So I started making the Gunpla. Yeah. So I started building Gunther models, and I'd always wanted to do that. Well, for years and years, I'd wanted to get into it. I was like, and then finally, thought I thought
Lara:you had the time.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Also, like, the space and stuff to, you know, leave leave a a model out for a bit without it taking over the dining room table or something like that. And so I but I wasn't, like, nervous about doing it. I was I was more excited.
Josué:And then once I started doing it, I realized that it was so much harder than I thought it was. Mhmm. And that it had so much depth.
Lara:Because like It's interesting because that's like the opposite of like, I was nervous about doing this, the the DM ing. And it was easier than I thought it was going to be, but probably had the same amount of depth. Yeah.
Josué:I guess yeah. Maybe I don't I don't know why I I thought it wouldn't be like, I just thought it would be easy. It's like I would
Lara:send them free. But with glue. Yeah.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Like, you don't even need glue for some of these. But then they look they don't look good if you just do it like that. Then you're like, oh, I wanna make it look a little better or I want to and then you're like, oh, you can do all of these things.
Josué:And there's layers on layers on layers of it. And I learned I learned a lot and gained a lot of new skills when I was building those. A big part of that also was that learning process was watching videos on YouTube Mhmm. Of people doing it and, like, learning all of these different tips and tricks on how to do it. That was that was, like I don't know.
Josué:I like learning new things. I like doing new things. So, like, in terms of hobbies and stuff like that, I have no interest in DMing. So that's, like, the difference. Right?
Josué:Like like, you wanted to do it. I have no interest whatsoever. And I don't play very many I think the only two times I've ever played any role playing game has been with you, Lara.
Link:Mhmm.
Lara:Yeah. You played D and D and a Star Wars game.
Josué:And a Star Wars game. Yeah. I don't think I've done any others. It's like it's like quite a commitment. So it's like, you know, in part, it's not not something I think about very often.
Josué:Let me see. I'm trying to think of another I guess, same thing happened when I got into plants. Mhmm. I'm a, you know, I'm a I'm a millennial plant parent from from the pandemic, and that was a whole other thing. But I get I get really into it, so I started learning a whole bunch of stuff.
Josué:And then yeah. Also harder than I thought it would be because there's, yeah, they're needy. These plants are needy.
Lara:I think the difference is I assume everything is gonna be hard and you assume everything's gonna be easy.
Josué:That's fun. That's funny. Maybe. Is that true?
Lara:I don't know. Can't be true. But here's the thing. The thing well, with the DM ing, not the not the crocheting, but with the DM ing, I'm doing something that involves a human element that is somebody else. Right?
Lara:That it's I'm not I'm in control of the situation, but I'm not in control of the situation. Right? There's the illusion of control. And for you, like, it was it's things you're like, this is gonna be easy. These are things that you're doing with and the plants were probably harder because even though they don't have brains
Josué:They're alive.
Lara:They're alive.
Josué:Some of them are still alive.
Lara:Yeah. Some of them are still alive. Yeah. That's better than a lot of my plants.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. I'm trying to think what else. I got a guitar recently. That was very hard.
Josué:That's been very, very hard. But again, I wasn't, like, nervous about it. I think yeah. I think that that helps. That helps.
Josué:I wonder if if there's anything else, why did I finally pull the trigger on the guitar? I it's funny because, like, in terms of motivation well, I'm curious. So what was your motivation for wanting to DM?
Lara:I think it's been fun to play games with other people. And I I think I've had a creative, like, urge for the last, like
Josué:Okay.
Lara:More about a year because I was planning on writing the the, like, novelization of my kids on Burns game with Kayla, like, last year.
Link:Mhmm.
Lara:Which it's NaNoWriMo, and I was gonna start doing that today, and that's not gonna happen. But that creative push and that wanting to do something Because I've always seen my creativity as something like, I was good at photography. Right? Because it was I took pictures of the world. I didn't have to create anything.
Lara:Crocheting, I'm using other people's patterns. So I'm making something, but it's someone else's idea. And so I wanted to try to be able to run a story, And this is a way to practice someone else's story to be able to eventually figure out how to do my own. I also do wanna use this with clients. I do wanna be able to run RPGs with clients and just kinda get a feel for what it's like to play one on one with somebody, especially because D and D is one of many different games that I would probably try to use in a session with somebody.
Lara:And it's not the best for a lot of things, but it's what people know. And so it's something if they're into that, okay, we'll figure out how to use that. So and I do have plenty of other games where it could be a more like, are games designed for two players, and I have a few of them. But I wanted to be able to do this with with Nina and kind of play around with it and see if I could take on something a little more crunchy, like D and D.
Josué:Got it. Got it. Like, do you feel that your life had to be like, your mood, your life, your situation had to be, like, in a particular place for you to, you know, before you felt like you were ready to take something take something like that on or do it?
Lara:I don't know exactly what got me. I think we play D and D with Kayla and our other friend every other week. And so I was thinking, oh, well, we don't really have anything on the other Thursdays anymore. How about we play just the two of us on that other night so that we keep the momentum going because both of us kind of miss not we miss playing on the off weeks. So I think that was my motivation to actually kinda just, yeah, sure.
Lara:I could do that. Let let's try it. And but as far as the internal push to, like, run a game, I don't know what what was the final straw that was like, I can do this. I'm finally ready. I think it was just a we miss playing.
Lara:Maybe I'm ready. I've had friends pushing me to try and run a game for a while, but I still feel a bit nervous about trying to run it from more than one person.
Josué:So Mhmm. Yeah. Because I with the Gundam models for me, it was pandemic was part of it. Right? It's like, oh, now I have I have more time.
Josué:So I can definitely do that now. With the guitar, it was it was kind of like, I have more time. I feel more relaxed right now. I wanna do something. Like, I've I've been interested for a while.
Josué:I want to challenge myself. I think it'll be good for my mental health. So it was always also something like, I think this will be it'll be fun. Like, there were all these reasons that that for why I wanted to do it, but I think also my life was in a place where it was like, okay. Yeah.
Josué:No. This is I think I can handle it right now. I think I can use and I think it will be beneficial. That's why I was asking because sometimes we wanna do something new and, like, it's just not the right time.
Lara:Well and I think one of the things I mean, it's not necessarily the reason, but I I work less now. I have a job that allows me to have a flexible schedule and not have to work my Thursday evenings and afternoons. So I'm able to have the time and the capacity. At my last job, my brain would have been fried and I would not have been able to do this. Wouldn't have the brain energy to do it.
Lara:I could play even now. Some nights I'm better at playing a game than others. Sometimes I'm still checked out because it's a particularly rough week. And with Nina, I think it's a low stakes like, hey, it's been a rough week. I think maybe we can postpone it till the weekend or something.
Lara:Yeah. Yeah. So or skip this week or whatever. So yeah, some of it is like being in the space to be able to make the brain do creative things and be ready for a new thing.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. I think that applies in general. Right? Like, you wanna add something else to your plate, but sometimes just the the circumstances are not are not there.
Josué:And then it just like you said, it's harder. When I bought the guitar, I was, like, into it, and I was practicing every day. Then I lost my job, and I practiced for, like, two days after that, and I just I just can't do it. Mhmm. It's like before, it was like, oh, it was challenging.
Josué:It was a welcome challenge. And now I'm like, I don't want anything else hard Yeah. With my life. I don't care.
Lara:We'll play Spider Man.
Josué:Yeah. Exactly. I mean, give me something passive that I can press a few buttons, but I haven't I haven't touched the guitar in a while. And it's yeah. Like, I just can't do it because now I'm I'm my situation has changed completely, and I'm not in a place where I can do that or a whole bunch or anything else new.
Josué:Like, I'm too I'm too anxious and worried and upset about other stuff to to, like, do something like that that I would enjoy. And it sucks because the same reasons why I wanted to do it could probably be beneficial now. It would be distracting, probably be good for my mental health. It was, you know, it would give me some sense of accomplishment if I'm moving forward, but life is not it's like, circumstances are just not there right now to to do something new.
Lara:Yeah. Yeah. Well, and with this thing with the DMing, I think it's been good to I mean, Nina and I have literally played one of these quests and had a session zero, which was nice to get the experience of running a session zero for somebody and talking about what they want in the game, what's your character like. First time for me, being the one asking the questions, how does this character know this person? What's something from your past that you kind of regret?
Lara:All of these kinds of things. But this idea that with with Nina, I can be more flexible about it. She might be disappointed, but we could figure something out, just the two of us. It is really it impossible. As anyone who has played a role playing game knows, it is impossible to try and get the number of people at the table on a regular schedule.
Lara:And consistently. Sometimes, like I said, I maybe I have a tough week at work and I'm not able to run a game. I would not I am the kind of person who would feel really bad about disappointing a bunch of people. And I think one of the harder things for me would be I would wanna push and do it. And I have a hard enough time holding my, like, three RPG characters in my head and my own brain and my clients in my head.
Lara:And that's what, like, 25 of them. So then holding all these other characters, these NPCs in in running a DM as a DM, that's a lot more personalities to try and shove in my brain that are not exactly like my personality. So
Josué:But even if you're committed, at least, like, it's not new. Right? Like Mhmm. Like, if you have if you had a bad day and you're committed to doing it, it's less stressful now that you've started doing it.
Lara:Because it's not because it's not a brand new thing.
Josué:Yeah.
Lara:Yeah. And also, with Nina, I get to practice, like, saying no and holding my boundaries. So
Josué:True. True. If she doesn't show up one day, is it just you and the NPCs
Lara:Yeah. Going on an adventure? Gonna have an adventure in my journal. And Cool. I will tell her you missed out on a lot of fun.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Missed out on two two big events. Mhmm.
Lara:Mhmm. The dragon came and ate your character. Sorry.
Josué:Actually, you died while you were the week you missed.
Link:Had a funeral and everything.
Josué:Yep. Yep.
Lara:That emotional figure out how to bring you back, or you gotta build a new character. Wow.
Josué:Character. Yep. Yep. Yeah.
Lara:It's been it's been a lot of fun, and I'm I'm looking forward to more, stretching the creative pieces of my brain. Improv is not my greatest strong suit. I like to know what my character I plan a lot of things out when Kayla and I are playing in Kids on Brooms. And for our D and D campaign, we've been playing with Nina and a friend of ours. I'm a little less prepared, and I think it shows.
Lara:So I'm trying to both be prepared for this game, and also try and stretch those like, oh, because players never do what you think they're gonna do, so I have to be able to pivot on my preparations. Yeah.
Link:Improv is a skill too. You gotta practice that one.
Josué:Mhmm. Mhmm.
Lara:Been watching a lot of Dropout so that I can Oh, yeah. Oh, now I know how to improv all this stuff just by watching it, you know? That's not exactly true. Watching doctors on TV doesn't make you a doctor. Watching improv TV doesn't make you an improv comedian.
Josué:That's I mean, that's a that's a good point. I know that's the other thing you were you were talking about too. It's like, oh, I've been on the other side of it. No. I'm on this side.
Josué:Mhmm. That's not always Mhmm. It's not always the skills aren't always transferable. And
Lara:Not always.
Josué:Yeah. But it helps to to have been on the other side. Mhmm. Like, sure, like being a client and being a therapist, I mean, gives you some insight.
Lara:There is a reason that many schools require you to have gone to at least some therapy Yeah. To be a therapist. Yeah.
Josué:Mhmm. All therapists need therapy, but not all of them have attended. So
Lara:Mhmm.
Josué:It's good. It's good to to require that. And with the D and D stuff, so you've been playing D and D for like ten years?
Lara:I've been playing I played D and D for it was 2008. I played D and D for about a year, and then I did not play for ten years.
Josué:Oh, okay. Okay. Okay. Alright.
Lara:So I've technically only played D and D for, like, six years total.
Josué:Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe if I played more, you know, I might get to that point where I'm like, oh, well, I'd like to try that other that other part of it sit on the other side of the tail. But I have again, I don't know.
Josué:Haven't been exposed to it enough to to want to do that.
Lara:Yeah. Yeah.
Josué:Yeah.
Lara:And for me, I think part of the fun is also with this especially is like that, like, what if scenario kind of thing where it's like completely different characters running through the same exact thing. But it's like, this is a little off. Like, what happened here? Somehow Nina convinced me to give her two potions of healing instead of just one. But she made a good she bartered a good deal with the Manticore, did not have to fight, and then had the healer, the midwife, offer to cook for the manticore once a month.
Lara:Like, this is I two potions of healing for Nina. And now the manticore is getting dinner once a month from this person. And I just kind of rolled my eyes and thought it was hilarious.
Josué:So she here playing every once. Yeah. Yeah.
Lara:Yeah. And I think that's the thing. I'm trying to take this as like, this is fun. And the point of whatever game I'm running with clients, the point is for them to have fun and learn about themselves. That's that's the whole point.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So to to to recap the things that made it easier where that you've you've been exposed from the other side.
Josué:Mhmm. You've you've played quite a lot. You used the beginner's version of it, like, the
Lara:I I'm having someone basically hold my hand through it.
Josué:Yep. Yep. And you're playing with with someone who, you know, it's it's it's it's safer. Safe. Yeah.
Josué:Plus, it gives you the flexibility, like you said. I mean, by having fewer people, you can you can take a day off if you're moving
Link:to live in the same house. It really helps.
Josué:Live in the same house.
Lara:It really it really helps. It really does.
Josué:Mhmm. Yeah. I mean, it's like, you know, when we talk about exposure therapy and things like that, like, you you start Mhmm. You know, you come up with different versions of it that are that are safer and simpler, and then you can you go and you make it more complicated as you go through. So it would have been a very different experience for you to DM another campaign for six people all at once as your as your first one.
Josué:Yeah. Not not
Lara:That was not that was not gonna happen.
Josué:Yeah. So again, like like, do you feel I know you're slightly more nervous about I mean, you have you're nervous about different things for the for the second thing, but, like, do you feel how do you feel in general? More confident? Do you feel
Lara:More com more comfortable and confident. Yeah. Think I again, I already know what kind of shit like, of course, she's gonna surprise me, but I know Nina likes to throw a lot of shenanigans out there, and it'll be fun. So I'm not, like, worried about that anymore because I've experienced someone, like, just throwing, like, a curveball at me and been like, okay. What am I gonna do with that?
Lara:So, yeah, it's more the meatier bits of the game that I am familiar with, but not from a DM's role. Right? Like, as a player, you have a character sheet that's got a lot of stuff on it, and you don't have to look at anything until your DM says, what's what's your perception? And things like that. So I have a lot more moving parts because I need to know what skills I should be calling for and, like, knowing where creatures are in a dungeon, that kind of thing.
Lara:Yeah. The manual for this for the essentials kit isn't that big, but it also can be kind of overwhelming at times.
Josué:Yeah. And for the second like, there are different skills now that you'll use for the second time around because you need to build off of the first one. Mhmm. The first time you didn't have that. Yep.
Josué:You have to deal with all Nina's crazy things that she got away with, make sure and make some adjustments.
Lara:Yeah. Exactly.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. I'm proud of you, Lara. Good on you.
Lara:Me too. Thank you. Don't expect me to run any games for you.
Josué:Character growth. Are you sure? I mean, just just do it. Like, it's the same campaign. Just
Lara:just Let me find where we left off and, like
Josué:Yeah. Just just have Nina join in. Right? And then we'll just finish it finish the the the both campaigns in one shot. Wait.
Josué:That might work.
Lara:We will.
Josué:That might actually work.
Lara:Wait a second. I'll just throw dark feet in there as a NPC, and that might actually work. We'll see. We'll see. Yeah.
Lara:It's gonna be a while before we get there. We'll find out.
Link:Look. The people have been clamoring for the return of Bonk, so I don't I don't know. I feel like you shouldn't you should give the people what they want. And by people, I do mean just me.
Josué:We did actually get a few messages asking Asking when when the new episodes were coming. That was years ago. That was years ago. That was years ago. Oh, it's funny.
Josué:Actually, one last thought is we got an email this week from someone who said that she's 65 years old and she went back to school and she wants to write a paper on using D and D in therapy. I don't know what she went back to school for.
Lara:I don't
Josué:know if she's like starting to do therapy or what, but she wanted to write about that. She said that she got into D and D eight years ago because of her adult son.
Lara:Yeah. So in her fifties.
Josué:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And now she's 65 and going back to school.
Josué:So I just wanna make the point that, like, you know, it's never too late to try something new either. I think I think you're you know, we're using DM ing a D and D game as as an example of kinda how to ease into it, and and those are pretty good. I think you did all the right things to
Lara:Yeah. To Yeah.
Josué:To start off. I think I think that's helpful. Think I that's helpful. There are a lot of things that I've tried, brand new, that I have not gone into with that kind of support and maybe, you know, starting. Sometimes it's good to, you know, start at level zero, level one, and then work your way up.
Josué:It is not a recipe for success to just dive in hard mode.
Lara:Yeah. It's true. Although sometimes jumping in at level five or six, especially in D and D can be nice because you get the big the guns. That's why
Josué:it's trying so hard to be like prodder metaphor,
Link:and you're like, no, we're talking
Lara:about D
Link:and D levels.
Lara:I just got my second seat. I know. It's very different. Right? The game Nina and I are playing with other people, we started at level five.
Lara:We're, like, level six now. We've got all these spells, we're going back in this game. Nina started at level one. And you know what? It is kind of fun to start back at the beginning again.
Lara:And also look forward to getting those nice feats later on.
Josué:Well, I I meant level in terms of, like
Link:I know.
Josué:Like I know. No. No. No. No.
Josué:But this is this is a this is a good this is a good distinction because, sure, starting, like, overpowered, like Right. You know, is is good. Like, that's what you're referring to. Right? It's like having, know, having a few more skill points and having, you know, just just having a better character, a stronger character is good.
Josué:That's like starting something new with, you know, like, someone who's world class at it and having more money and maybe having better equipment. Right? That's that's like yeah. No. That's a much better way to do it.
Josué:Be a lot easier to learn guitar if I had, you know, like I don't I don't I
Link:don't know. It feels it feels more like starting starting your very first game and starting at a higher level. It's like, it gives you more utility as in your character, which is great and more fun, but it is more complicated because there are more things
Lara:to And more it's
Link:So I feel like a better analogous connection to music would be like you get the guitar and you get the amp and all the chords that you need and you get the little the switchboard thing and the and the the whammy bar. And it's like, you have all of this extra stuff that could could make it more fun, but it is also more complicated because there are more pieces to it.
Josué:It can be.
Link:It doesn't necessarily hinder your learning in any way, except that there are more pieces.
Josué:Sure. That's one version of it. That's also possible. Yeah. There's also the version of, like, oh, you just got, like, more, you know, more Mhmm.
Josué:Or better. And it it doesn't necessarily have to be more of a one, but it's possible too. That's true. That's true. Alright.
Josué:So any any comments, Link, as as we wrap up?
Link:I think it's important to try new things as a human being. But like like you said earlier, Josue, like context matters. The other stuff that's going on in your life is gonna make it easier or harder to try new things. And so like Laura did, finding ways to make that first foray a little bit easier is the way to go. Remove some of the blockades when you can and give yourself boosts when you can.
Link:Play D and D. It's fun. Mhmm.
Josué:DM. It's fun. Yes.
Link:I mean, I I think Have you ever DM'd? I have. I have I have DM'd before. I have DM'd a D and D game, and I have DMs a
Josué:so like what I was saying
Link:before about making it easier for yourself.
Josué:When you made the joke about
Link:one person versus six people, that actually did feel pretty targeted because I did, like, basically
Lara:using Trial by fire?
Link:Yeah. Like, using, like, the kids on bikes baseline, like, mechanics and then building off of that to add my own shit in because I wanted to use all of the dice. I didn't like that a lot of D and D games. It's like you are either using the d 20 or you're using the d six and that's it. I was like, wanna use all of them.
Link:And then I had I want wanted to play with my friends, and I had more people than really was appropriate for my first time trying to do something like that. But we had a good time anyways. It didn't go how I wanted it, but it was still fun. I would suggest playing before trying to DM, but there are 100% systems that exist where DMing your first time is the same as playing your first time is just go for it. It's fun.
Link:It's supposed to be play, which means, like, you might get a a mental skinned knee, but you're still gonna have a good time.
Josué:As with D and D and in life, things will not always go as you plan them.
Lara:A life
Josué:lesson right there. True. That's my closing thought. Your closing thoughts?
Lara:Try new things. It's fun. Do the thing that you've been thinking about doing and wanting to do as long as your brain matter lets you do it.
Josué:Okay. Okay. Let us know how you've tried anything new lately. Was it challenging? Not challenging?
Josué:Was any of this helpful in contextualizing how to try new things? Do you think you might use this in your conversations with friends, family, clients, students?
Link:If you use Dungeons and Dragons or other role playing games in your therapy work or adjacent therapy work, did you play other games by yourself or with maybe your wife or friends before you tried bringing that into therapy? I'd be very interested to hear those stories.
Josué:Yeah. Tell us in in the our community spaces, which you can find links to in the show notes. For more geek therapy, visit geektherapy.org. Thank you so much for listening. Remember to geek out and do good.
Josué:I'll be back next week.
Link:Bye.
Josué:Geek Therapy is a five zero one c three nonprofit organization dedicated to making the world a better place through geek culture. To learn more about our mission and become a supporter, visit geektherapy.org.
